Vascular Dementia and Bredesen Protocol

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tennesseedirt
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Vascular Dementia and Bredesen Protocol

Post by tennesseedirt »

Hello,

My mother is in the process of diagnosis through her neurologist. I think the neurologist suspects my mother has vascular dementia. We are waiting on an MRI that will not include Volumetrics which is so frustrating. If the neurologist diagnoses mom with vascular dementia, will the Bredesen protocol help her? I am trying to convince my sister to take mom to a Bredesen trained MD in Raleigh who takes Medicare. I also want another MRI performed including Volumetrics. Any help would be greatly appreciated. I can't seem to find much about Bredesen Protocols and Vascular Dementia.
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Re: Vascular Dementia and Bredesen Protocol

Post by Tincup »

A search on vascular dementia in the Kindle versions of both "The End of Alzheimer's" and "The End of Alzheimer's Program" books has quite a few hits.

Here is one: "Additionally, those with vascular dementia or known heart disease should prioritize healing their underlying insulin resistance before implementing nutritional ketosis. See this page in chapter 8."

Bredesen, Dale. The End of Alzheimer's Program (p. 71). Penguin Publishing Group. Kindle Edition.
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Re: Vascular Dementia and Bredesen Protocol

Post by SBee »

tennesseedirt wrote: Wed Jan 12, 2022 7:39 am Hello,

My mother is in the process of diagnosis through her neurologist. I think the neurologist suspects my mother has vascular dementia. We are waiting on an MRI that will not include Volumetrics which is so frustrating. If the neurologist diagnoses mom with vascular dementia, will the Bredesen protocol help her? I am trying to convince my sister to take mom to a Bredesen trained MD in Raleigh who takes Medicare. I also want another MRI performed including Volumetrics. Any help would be greatly appreciated. I can't seem to find much about Bredesen Protocols and Vascular Dementia.

Welcome, tennesseedirt!
Thank you for reaching out with your concerns about the process involving your mom's diagnosis and your inquiry about the Bredesen protocol regarding its support with vascular dementia. I see that tincup already provided a response to your question. It's certainly admirable that you are seeking to be proactive in supporting your mom with her diagnosis and treatment! I'm sure many community members here can empathize with your situation.

As an Apoe4.info support team intern, I can share with you several tools on the site that may help in your search for more information /strategies:

If you would like to learn more about ApoE4 itself, I can direct you to the Primer, which is a detailed and informative resource written by a practicing M.D. with ApoE4/4. It includes information about the biochemistry of the ApoE4 gene and offers a variety of research-based prevention strategies.

The How-To Guide offers tips on how to navigate forums and respond to posts including how to quote members (use the quotation icon in the upper right of any post) so they get an email notification of your post. It also demonstrates how to use the Search function for topics, and how to subscribe to topics of interest in the forums.

Finally, if you are interested in sharing more details about your mom's story or just want to learn more about other community members' experiences, you can link to Our Stories.

I wish you and your family all the best in support of your mom! Please feel free to reach out with any additional questions you may have. Take care and be well!

Warmly,
Sue
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tennesseedirt
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Re: Vascular Dementia and Bredesen Protocol

Post by tennesseedirt »

Tincup wrote: Wed Jan 12, 2022 7:50 am A search on vascular dementia in the Kindle versions of both "The End of Alzheimer's" and "The End of Alzheimer's Program" books has quite a few hits.

Here is one: "Additionally, those with vascular dementia or known heart disease should prioritize healing their underlying insulin resistance before implementing nutritional ketosis. See this page in chapter 8."

Bredesen, Dale. The End of Alzheimer's Program (p. 71). Penguin Publishing Group. Kindle Edition.
Thank you so much!
tennesseedirt
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Re: Vascular Dementia and Bredesen Protocol

Post by tennesseedirt »

SBee wrote: Wed Jan 12, 2022 8:18 am
tennesseedirt wrote: Wed Jan 12, 2022 7:39 am Hello,

My mother is in the process of diagnosis through her neurologist. I think the neurologist suspects my mother has vascular dementia. We are waiting on an MRI that will not include Volumetrics which is so frustrating. If the neurologist diagnoses mom with vascular dementia, will the Bredesen protocol help her? I am trying to convince my sister to take mom to a Bredesen trained MD in Raleigh who takes Medicare. I also want another MRI performed including Volumetrics. Any help would be greatly appreciated. I can't seem to find much about Bredesen Protocols and Vascular Dementia.

Welcome, tennesseedirt!
Thank you for reaching out with your concerns about the process involving your mom's diagnosis and your inquiry about the Bredesen protocol regarding its support with vascular dementia. I see that tincup already provided a response to your question. It's certainly admirable that you are seeking to be proactive in supporting your mom with her diagnosis and treatment! I'm sure many community members here can empathize with your situation.

As an Apoe4.info support team intern, I can share with you several tools on the site that may help in your search for more information /strategies:

If you would like to learn more about ApoE4 itself, I can direct you to the Primer, which is a detailed and informative resource written by a practicing M.D. with ApoE4/4. It includes information about the biochemistry of the ApoE4 gene and offers a variety of research-based prevention strategies.

The How-To Guide offers tips on how to navigate forums and respond to posts including how to quote members (use the quotation icon in the upper right of any post) so they get an email notification of your post. It also demonstrates how to use the Search function for topics, and how to subscribe to topics of interest in the forums.

Finally, if you are interested in sharing more details about your mom's story or just want to learn more about other community members' experiences, you can link to Our Stories.

I wish you and your family all the best in support of your mom! Please feel free to reach out with any additional questions you may have. Take care and be well!

Warmly,
Sue
Thank you, Sue!
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Re: Vascular Dementia and Bredesen Protocol

Post by NF52 »

tennesseedirt wrote: Wed Jan 12, 2022 7:39 am Hello,

My mother is in the process of diagnosis through her neurologist. I think the neurologist suspects my mother has vascular dementia. We are waiting on an MRI that will not include Volumetrics which is so frustrating. If the neurologist diagnoses mom with vascular dementia, will the Bredesen protocol help her? I am trying to convince my sister to take mom to a Bredesen trained MD in Raleigh who takes Medicare. I also want another MRI performed including Volumetrics. Any help would be greatly appreciated. I can't seem to find much about Bredesen Protocols and Vascular Dementia.
A warm welcome, "tennesseedirt", from someone whose mother had a combination of both vascular disease and Alzheimer's disease as causes of her dementia.

I think the strategies in Dr. Bredesen's protocol and also in our PRIMER would be a very helpful start, recognizing that your mother still has a great deal of choice in who she wants to have as a doctor and how far she (and your sister) is able or willing to travel. Sometimes it's easier to suggest small changes; for example, olive oil instead of butter for cooking; less sausage and biscuits (if she's a native Southerner) and more eggs and avocado or some blueberries for breakfast, or adding some B-12 methylcobalamin if her B-12 levels are below 500, which her current doctor could easily test.

With apologies in case this is too much info or old news:
Vascular dementia happens after years of changes to the blood vessels in the brain or carotid arteries, or high blood pressure, or maybe a history of a stroke. The effects of vascular disease can be seen on an MRI as white spots (white matter hyper intensities) or as areas where neurons have been damaged, leading to lower brain volumes in those areas.

Alzheimer's dementia also happens decades after early changes in levels of amyloid beta in the brain and eventually added tau tangles that are more directly linked to loss of neurons. Amyloid and tau can't directly be seen on an MRI; they are viewed on PET scans using an IV with a tiny amount of radioactive "tracer".

So far those PET scans are rarely used outside of clinical trials because people can have the "imaging biomarkers" of both vascular and Alzheimer's disease without any changes in thinking or daily living skills. Neurologists have used standardized assessments of language, memory, visual skills, processing speed, along with the person's own sense of any changes ("subjective cognitive impairment) and changes noted by family members to diagnose probable Alzheimer's and/or vascular dementia. Once those changes are seen, it's very likely that an MRI will be able to confirm whether the brain shows a reduction on size as a result of some loss of neurons (atrophy) in one or more areas as well as the signs of vascular dementia. The MRI might help rule in a vascular issue, which might then lead to discussion of various options for suspected or known vascular issues. The addition of a volumetric MRI would not show amyloid plaques or tau tangles; it uses a proprietary computer-learning algorithm to rate multiple areas of the brain as a percentage of what would be expected at that age, I believe.

Many people over the age of 70, and most of those over the age of 80, who have cognitive impairments also have biomarkers of both Alzheimer's and vascular changes, so the neurologist may be able to tell you or your sister whether your mother's age or any pre-existing vascular issues made him order the MRI.

The FDA recently approved a simple blood test called PrecivityAD PrecivityAD which has a high degree of accuracy in showing elevated amyloid without the need for a PET scan. Your mother's neurologist may be able to order this to add to the information provided by her MRI if you are wondering about Alzheimer's biomarkers; I believe Medicare covers the cost for diagnostic purposes.

Just one comment on my experience having multiple MRIs for clinical trials of healthy people with risk of AD:

The results of the MRIs have been summarized for me and the study site explained that they can tell whether I have had brain bleeds, micro-hemorrhages , brain edema (swelling from fluid) or atrophy. I have MRIs because they help the studies, but they are not pleasant! They're incredibly noisy--like a jackhammer inside a subway tunnel with a mad percussionist using drums and cymbals. I wear regular clothes, but lie down on a narrow table with a helmet with a lattice-work face guard and ear protection fastened on my head, straps tightened over my stomach and legs to keep my body from moving and the direction to lie absolutely still (no scratching an itch or crossing your arms) for 30-40 minutes. My fingers usually fall asleep and start tingling painfully after 15 minutes! I know several brave people who cannot go into an MRI due to claustrophobia.

I would gently suggest that another MRI isn't going to be make or break for your mom. A careful assessment of how your mom is doing in everyday life may be a great help. What are her values and preferences and how can her day be organized to have more joy and less frustration or anxiety? You and your sister might find common ground by talking about what she sees as changes or issues, especially those that affect her safety or needs (travel, medication, mobility).

I know several people with mild AD whose friends pitch in from time to time to pick up prescriptions, offer a ride to church, share a picnic or go out for a special event, volunteer at church, enjoy trips to the N. Carolina beaches. This is a great time to reach out to friends, neighbors, church groups and extended family nearby!

Your mother is about to start a new chapter in a life that can still have many great moments. In pictures of my daughter's wedding, my mother and mother-in-law are both beaming. No one would guess from their expressions that they had vascular and AD disease with "moderate" dementia on that wedding day. We are always much more our feelings and families than we are our memories and thinking skills.
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Re: Vascular Dementia and Bredesen Protocol

Post by tennesseedirt »

Thank you so much for your kind encouragement. I have been so stressed about my mother recently. I have listened to the End of Alzheimer's three times on Audible and I am finishing the End of Alzheimer's Program now. I so want the protocols to be applicable to mom. The success stories in the books really gave me hope for my mother. I don't know if vascular dementia can be reversed like other types in the books.
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Re: Vascular Dementia and Bredesen Protocol

Post by Julie G »

tennesseedirt wrote: Wed Jan 12, 2022 7:39 am Hello,

My mother is in the process of diagnosis through her neurologist. I think the neurologist suspects my mother has vascular dementia. We are waiting on an MRI that will not include Volumetrics which is so frustrating. If the neurologist diagnoses mom with vascular dementia, will the Bredesen protocol help her? I am trying to convince my sister to take mom to a Bredesen trained MD in Raleigh who takes Medicare. I also want another MRI performed including Volumetrics. Any help would be greatly appreciated. I can't seem to find much about Bredesen Pro]tocols and Vascular Dementia.
FWIW, Dr. Bredesen (and others in the field including Dr. Gonzalez-Lima, in this Peter Attia podcast ) don't consider vascular dementia to be a separate disease process, but rather part and parcel of what can lead to Alzheimer's. The End of Alzheimer's Program does discuss this topic as pointed out by Tincup. The most important dietary consideration is to stop all inflammatory foods (sugar, refined carbs, grains, conventional dairy) before adding in even healthy fats, like high polyphenol EVOO. It's really helpful to work with a cardiologist who endorses a low carb approach so the treatment plan for the heart and brain are unified. Insulin resistance is a huge driver of vascular disease. It's important to focus on that first.
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Re: Vascular Dementia and Bredesen Protocol

Post by tennesseedirt »

Julie,

Thank you so much! You have given me hope.
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