Five days into taking 0.5 mg / kg methylene blue

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29yoapoe4male
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Re: Five days into taking 0.5 mg / kg methylene blue

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Belfastman wrote: Thu Jan 26, 2023 8:58 am Would be great to get an update on your progress.
Love it! I feel healed / restored. After the initial days of huge energy surge, I’m accustomed to not being tired anymore and it’s basically like having the energy levels of my early twenties back
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Re: Five days into taking 0.5 mg / kg methylene blue

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29yoapoe4male wrote: Thu Jan 26, 2023 3:41 pm
Belfastman wrote: Thu Jan 26, 2023 8:58 am Would be great to get an update on your progress.
Love it! I feel healed / restored. After the initial days of huge energy surge, I’m accustomed to not being tired anymore and it’s basically like having the energy levels of my early twenties back
I would say responses may vary, depending on you and your issues. I'm 67 and have not felt an energy surge, however I'm high energy anyway and have been doing a lot of things for quite a while. These include:

- 0.3 mg methylene blue/day/kg
- 200 mg homotaurine/day
- 1 dose/day Prodrome Neuro plasmalogen precursor
- eat a low lectin pescatarian diet prepared by me without ultra processed food. I also strive for at least 40 g protein at my first and last meals of the day for muscle protein synthesis, with at total protein target of around 1.25 g/kg/day. 10g of an essential amino acid supplement to kick off the day.
- consuming food in an 8 hour or smaller window, with ideally 4 hours between last meal and sleep
- maintaining weight to what I weighed in grade 10 while being leaner than then
- lots of Zone 2 exercise, including 20 minutes daily after my evening meal
- strength training
- mobility training
- at least one HIIT training session a week
- rock climbing
- alpine skiing
- consistent sleep circadian rhythm
- always nasal breathing, including mouth taping during sleep
- 3 minutes morning cold exposure in 33 deg F water + cold showers and wearing few clothes in the winter
- 30 minutes heat exposure in a 4 x 250 watt heat lamp near infrared sauna
- breath training and meditation
- keep blood pressure around 110/60
- resting heart rate in the 50's with the low 40's at night
- daily sun exposure with a lot of skin exposed, also morning and evening exposure of eyes to sunrise & sunset light
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Re: Five days into taking 0.5 mg / kg methylene blue

Post by 29yoapoe4male »

Tincup wrote: Thu Jan 26, 2023 6:36 pm
Belfastman wrote: Thu Jan 26, 2023 8:58 am Would be great to get an update on your progress.
I would say responses may vary, depending on you and your issues. I'm 67 and have not felt an energy surge, however I'm high energy anyway and have been doing a lot of things for quite a while. These include:

- 0.3 mg methylene blue/day/kg
- 50 mg homotaurine/day
- 1 dose/day Prodrome Neuro plasmalogen precursor
- eat a low lectin pescatarian diet prepared by me without ultra processed food. I also strive for at least 40 g protein at my first and last meals of the day for muscle protein synthesis, with at total protein target of around 1.25 g/kg/day
- consuming food in an 8 hour or smaller window, with ideally 4 hours between last meal and sleep
- maintaining weight to what I weighed in grade 10 while being leaner than then
- lots of Zone 2 exercise, including 20 minutes daily after my evening meal
- strength training
- mobility training
- at least one HIIT training session a week
- rock climbing
- alpine skiing
- consistent sleep circadian rhythm
- always nasal breathing, including mouth taping during sleep
- 3 minutes morning cold exposure in 33 deg F water + cold showers and wearing few clothes in the winter
- 30 minutes heat exposure in a 4 x 250 watt heat lamp near infrared sauna
- breath training and meditation
- keep blood pressure around 110/60
- resting heart rate in the 50's with the low 40's at night
- daily sun exposure with a lot of skin exposed
I was very low energy before taking

I ordered Gundrys book, checking into the lectin hypothesis which is quite new to me

Exercise particularly would exhaust me, I wouldn’t improve much and I wouldn’t gain much energy. Methylene blue greatly improved my performance physically.

Also I remember people’s names now and I didn’t before. My memory is far more functional. I had multiple strategies to get around having to remember specific details knowing I would not be able to, but now things will come to mind when they never would before etc. I do attribute most of these changes to methylene blue as I was doing the other things I do for a month or more before, and I wasn’t seeing any particular marked improvements. With the methylene blue the improvements were immediate, noticeable, marked in some of these ways I’ve mentioned
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Re: Five days into taking 0.5 mg / kg methylene blue

Post by Gail »

Hello,

This is a great thread on methylene blue and I thank everyone for their contributions. I am very curious/worried about my mitochondrial health so this is of interest to me. Thank you Tincup for all the references. I did listen to the Attia podcast, and the Mercola podcast with Gonzalez-Lima and it was so helpful.

Just wanted to add something I haven't seen mentioned. I've read elsewhere that some people have gotten nausea reactions from initial small doses of Methylene Blue.It is stated that Methylene Blue is a MAO Inhibitor. Here are all the drugs it has interactions with - including many anti-depressants. Be careful if using anti-depressants. And be careful with drug interactions.
https://www.drugs.com/drug-interactions ... -blue.html

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Re: Five days into taking 0.5 mg / kg methylene blue

Post by sarahb12 »

Also, I would read up on serotonin syndrome - which can happen with too much MB. Maoa genetics might influence how much is too much.
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Re: Five days into taking 0.5 mg / kg methylene blue

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Gail wrote: Fri Jan 27, 2023 10:24 am Just wanted to add something I haven't seen mentioned. I've read elsewhere that some people have gotten nausea reactions from initial small doses of Methylene Blue.It is stated that Methylene Blue is a MAO Inhibitor. Here are all the drugs it has interactions with - including many anti-depressants. Be careful if using anti-depressants. And be careful with drug interactions.
sarahb12 wrote: Fri Jan 27, 2023 11:21 pm Also, I would read up on serotonin syndrome - which can happen with too much MB. Maoa genetics might influence how much is too much.
In his interview with Mercola, Gonzalez-Lima said,

"With respect to the warning about the SSRIs, the problem is not methylene blue but the amount of SSRI. The problem was in a specific application of methylene blue where they use it for parathyroid surgery as a stain ...

To my knowledge, there’s never been more than five cases, where the patients were anesthetized, and they still had SSRIs [in their system], and they did repeated flushing in the open neck with methylene blue, which exceeded these doses that we have been talking about [0.5 - 2.0 mg/kg or less].

The U.S. FDA reacted with this warning. But this has been reviewed by both surgeons and pharmacologists at the Mayo Clinic, and they wrote a rebuttal paper where they indicate that there is no evidence to suggest oral methylene blue has any interaction with the therapeutic dosing of serotonergic compounds, especially SSRIs, and that this was something that happened under these specific [surgical] conditions.

Canada limits the warning to that particular application, but our FDA went beyond that to any kind of serotonergic drug. I think there is absolutely no evidence for oral methylene blue having interactions in this low-dose range with any SSRIs.

And when they talk about the MAO inhibitor function, it really only works as an MAO inhibitor in the higher concentration of the higher dose range, not the low-dose range. So, the effects of methylene blue as an antidepressant — only to a very limited extent, if you repeat it cumulative treatments — can be due to any kind of a MAO inhibitor role.

In addition, it is due to its metabolic enhancing function, so it antagonizes some of the depression symptoms like the low energy that is experienced with depression. So yes, it is effective to reduce symptoms of depression. Unfortunately, this warning is going to make some physicians scared of using it in combination with SSRIs.”
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Re: Five days into taking 0.5 mg / kg methylene blue

Post by 29yoapoe4male »

Tincup wrote: Sat Jan 28, 2023 5:19 am
Gail wrote: Fri Jan 27, 2023 10:24 am Just wanted to add something I haven't seen mentioned. I've read elsewhere that some people have gotten nausea reactions from initial small doses of Methylene Blue.It is stated that Methylene Blue is a MAO Inhibitor. Here are all the drugs it has interactions with - including many anti-depressants. Be careful if using anti-depressants. And be careful with drug interactions.
sarahb12 wrote: Fri Jan 27, 2023 11:21 pm Also, I would read up on serotonin syndrome - which can happen with too much MB. Maoa genetics might influence how much is too much.
In his interview with Mercola, Gonzalez-Lima said,

"With respect to the warning about the SSRIs, the problem is not methylene blue but the amount of SSRI. The problem was in a specific application of methylene blue where they use it for parathyroid surgery as a stain ...

To my knowledge, there’s never been more than five cases, where the patients were anesthetized, and they still had SSRIs [in their system], and they did repeated flushing in the open neck with methylene blue, which exceeded these doses that we have been talking about [0.5 - 2.0 mg/kg or less].

The U.S. FDA reacted with this warning. But this has been reviewed by both surgeons and pharmacologists at the Mayo Clinic, and they wrote a rebuttal paper where they indicate that there is no evidence to suggest oral methylene blue has any interaction with the therapeutic dosing of serotonergic compounds, especially SSRIs, and that this was something that happened under these specific [surgical] conditions.

Canada limits the warning to that particular application, but our FDA went beyond that to any kind of serotonergic drug. I think there is absolutely no evidence for oral methylene blue having interactions in this low-dose range with any SSRIs.

And when they talk about the MAO inhibitor function, it really only works as an MAO inhibitor in the higher concentration of the higher dose range, not the low-dose range. So, the effects of methylene blue as an antidepressant — only to a very limited extent, if you repeat it cumulative treatments — can be due to any kind of a MAO inhibitor role.

In addition, it is due to its metabolic enhancing function, so it antagonizes some of the depression symptoms like the low energy that is experienced with depression. So yes, it is effective to reduce symptoms of depression. Unfortunately, this warning is going to make some physicians scared of using it in combination with SSRIs.”
In support of this notion I have been taking with 50 mg of trazodone (for sleep) this week and saw no issues.
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Re: Five days into taking 0.5 mg / kg methylene blue

Post by Gail »

Tincup wrote: Sat Jan 28, 2023 5:19 am

In his interview with Mercola, Gonzalez-Lima said,

"With respect to the warning about the SSRIs, the problem is not methylene blue but the amount of SSRI. The problem was in a specific application of methylene blue where they use it for parathyroid surgery as a stain ...

To my knowledge, there’s never been more than five cases, where the patients were anesthetized, and they still had SSRIs [in their system], and they did repeated flushing in the open neck with methylene blue, which exceeded these doses that we have been talking about [0.5 - 2.0 mg/kg or less].

In addition, it is due to its metabolic enhancing function, so it antagonizes some of the depression symptoms like the low energy that is experienced with depression. So yes, it is effective to reduce symptoms of depression. Unfortunately, this warning is going to make some physicians scared of using it in combination with SSRIs.”
Hello Tincup, thank you for the clarification that there may be no interaction between Methylene Blue and SSRIs at the suggested low dose. Off label uses of pharmaceuticals can worry me - but I agree that the FDA can over react and over regulate. And they are influenced by Big Money Pharmaceutical companies that don't stand to make any dollars if Gonzalez-Lima is right about Methylene Blue's ability to help with Mitochondrial energetics and hence with neurodegenerative disease. Wow! You got that transcription of the Mercola/Gonzalez interview quick!! Something I missed and I will have to go back and listen again!

Tincup, one other question. If you mix Methylene Blue with ascorbic acid - do you use a pure form of ascorbic acid (no fillers or cellulose?). Also how long should it take for methylene blue to turn clear- is that an instaneous reaction? Or should it set for 20 minutes? Thanks for the reply!

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Re: Five days into taking 0.5 mg / kg methylene blue

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Gail wrote: Sat Jan 28, 2023 6:15 am Tincup, one other question. If you mix Methylene Blue with ascorbic acid - do you use a pure form of ascorbic acid (no fillers or cellulose?). Also how long should it take for methylene blue to turn clear- is that an instantaneous reaction? Or should it set for 20 minutes?
I've been using the NOW brand ascorbic acid powder. One use is to clean up MB around my sink. I'd say the reaction is pretty fast in this way, a few minutes. When I use it with the MB to consume, I put in 1 tsp in water & stir it up, then put in the MB (in my case 1 mL MB is about 23 mg). The 1 tsp of ascorbic acid powder isn't enough to turn it completely clear.

In my link to the Mercola interview, there is a partial transcript with quotes from the interview.
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Re: Five days into taking 0.5 mg / kg methylene blue

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Gail wrote: Fri Jan 27, 2023 10:24 am
sarahb12 wrote: Fri Jan 27, 2023 11:21 pm
Veero wrote: Fri Jan 20, 2023 11:52 pm
For everyone who discussed ascorbic acid, I had not been mixing it in as I'd been trying to normalize my copper/zinc ratio via hair analysis & had been cautioned against taking vitamin C by a counselor as it impairs copper absorption. Yesterday decided to add ascorbic acid to my methylene blue. Also happened to be wearing a continuous glucose monitor (just for info, I'm not diabetic). My glucose reading soard to the 180's mg/dL (10's mmol/L). Very anomalous for me. I'd not eaten a particularly high carb first meal and then had a modest lowish carb dinner. So decided to do a bunch of Zone 2 exercise till it dropped. Ended up doing 50 minutes and glucose dropped to 107 mg/dL (5.9 mmol/L). Went to bed and glucose was in the 90's overnight. This morning, it happened again after the ascorbic acid MB combination. Then it dawned on me. Ascorbic acid (& I think vitamin C generally) looks like glucose to a glucometer. Common issue for diabetics! So if you are doing this & taking your blood sugar, remember this

29yoapoe4male wrote: Fri Jan 27, 2023 9:00 am I was very low energy before taking

Exercise particularly would exhaust me, I wouldn’t improve much and I wouldn’t gain much energy. Methylene blue greatly improved my performance physically.

Also I remember people’s names now and I didn’t before. My memory is far more functional. I had multiple strategies to get around having to remember specific details knowing I would not be able to, but now things will come to mind when they never would before etc. I do attribute most of these changes to methylene blue as I was doing the other things I do for a month or more before, and I wasn’t seeing any particular marked improvements. With the methylene blue the improvements were immediate, noticeable, marked in some of these ways I’ve mentioned
In this post from 2019, I reference the work of Doug Wallace. He is the researcher who figured out that mitochondrial DNA are inherited from the mother (I understand sperm have DNA, but the egg kills it). My understanding is that unlike nuclear DNA, differences are bad (called heteroplasmy). Children who are born with mitochondrial issues tend not to live long. Wallace has studied these illnesses over his career. Also, we tend to get more heteroplasmy as we age because of mitochondrial DNA mutation, which is fairly frequent. Wallace explains that as heteroplasmy increases, disease phenotypes (observable traits) tend to change as a step function with % heteroplasmy. Meaning that say from 0-30% heteroplasmy you might get one phenotype, then from 30-60% another, yet another from 60-80% and another from 80-100%.

Wonder if you had some kind of heteroplasmy issue that the MB is solving. I recall in one interview Gonzalez-Lima saying there were people who had an inherited mDNA issue and lifelong MB could solve it, and they'd live normal lives.
I ordered Gundry's book, checking into the lectin hypothesis which is quite new to me.
It seems to make a big difference in people with autoimmunity (lifelong, in my case). I have consulted with Gundry a lot and one place where I deviate is on animal protein consumption. He's concerned about mTOR and cancer, but my understanding of the data is that sarcopenia is a more worrisome problem as we age. Also that with moderate daily fasting, it limits mTOR stimulation. One of the metrics Gundry tests for is IGF-1, as a proxy for mTOR stimulation. He'd like us in the 70-80 mg/dL range. Gundry also cites Valter Longo's fasting mimicking diet (FMD) research where Valter's subjects would go on a 5 day FMD and drop their IGF-1 from (nominally) 200 down to 150. When Gundry interviewed Paul Saladino, a doc and carnivore diet advocate, Paul said his and his patients' IGF-1 were around 120 (which is where mine tends). This is far below what Longo's subjects ended up with, so I'm satisfied that my protein intake is OK. I tend to follow the recommendations of protein researcher, Don Layman. In short, the first (whenever it happens) and last meals of the day are most important. Need at least 30 grams of animal protein (more, like 2x, if veg.) to get 3 g of leucine, which turns on muscle protein synthesis. Better to have 40-50g at these meals. Also total protein is likewise important. Per Layman, "Protein is like a vitamin pill, we don't have a requirement for vitamin pills, we have a requirement for 12 (or however many) vitamins. We don't have a protein requirement, we have a requirement for 9 essential amino acids (as well as a total nitrogen requirement)." Different foods have different levels of these amino acids.
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